Transcript
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Kwame
Hello, everybody. Welcome to this episode of Beyond Influence. Today, we have with us Kay Brown, who is a social media manager turned into an absolute social media phenomenon. It feels like she finds herself in every place in which pop and things are happening. She is the co-host of the Betty's Podcast and has done an incredible amount of growth in the social space.
So we were really excited to have her today. Hey, how are you doing?
Kay
Honestly, I haven't heard my government's name in forever. Kay Brown, it's always Clark City, so hearing the crowd, it's always like, yeah, I think I've met her once or twice that I'm excited to be here.
Kwame
Yeah, it's really funny. When I started to, you know, do my research about you, I realized that I didn't know exactly how to put the first and last name. Like, every time I put in Kay, it would come up Kay York City, so I can do a deep dive on the internet to find your last name.
Kay
I know I like to keep it that way because I'm like, I feel like my friends can know it. It's only located like on my LinkedIn and obviously articles of some things are out and then on Facebook, but that's really it.
Scott
When did you start going by Kay York City?
Kay
When I moved to New York in 2012. Like I just changed my Instagram name. Like I just got an Instagram. And so I was like, oh fine. I live in New York City. Let me just put this as my username. And then it stuck. And now that's what people call me out loud. It's very bizarre, but I love it.
Scott
That's funny. You never think like when you create a username on a social media platform, this is going to turn into your identity and know, like at least you picked a good one though, like, yeah. Right. Solid.
Kwame
Did you ever think about switching it when you left New York?
Kay
So I got an Instagram just because I was like, I don't want to rebrand or anything because it had been so long. It'd be weird to change something just based on my location. But I got off Instagram California just in case I decided to change it. but I don't use it ever. I just have it hiding somewhere.
Kwame
Just in case. You know, it's really funny. I thought about the Cork City thing, and I think the first time that we ever got in touch was online, it was because of the Netflix, kind of pop-up event that was going on in New York. And so in my head, you were a New Yorker. So when I first went to New York, I was there just a few days ago for IMS.
And as I was doing that, I was told to bring along some, you know, some creators. That way we could kind of all just get, you know, a nice networking event going on. And one of the first people I thought about was you. I was like, oh, yeah, like k York City. She has a view in New York.
And I looked up, of course. So I looked up the most recent things that you were doing, and I saw that you had just gotten your convertible mini Cooper-wrapped paint.
Kay
Yeah.
Kwame
Which, yeah, we'll definitely dive into that. But when I saw the pink convertible Mini Cooper, I was like, yeah, there's no way she's in New York.
Kay
Yeah, no, that's me and it's been so long. It's really weird because I get invited to a lot of events that are in New York or whatever because people assume that that's where I am, which I should. I feel like maybe my locations in my bio, I can't really remember. but I do get that all the time where friends will be like, so are you in LA full time?
I'm like, yeah, it's been like three and a half years. It's been a minute.
Kwame
Yeah, we'll make this entire podcast, a brainstorming session to come up with your new LA-associated handle.
Kay
Yeah. I mean, well, we have California, so that's like, sort of, but that's like Instagram. But it's true I'm just holding it on the side in case. Yeah. You know I have a snap one day and I'm like I have to change it right now.
Scott
Just a lot of amazing things going on with the podcast. All of our social media, you know, what's the most exciting thing you got going on? What are you excited about nowadays? obviously out in California, that's, you know, now a less recent change. But, you know, what's exciting, what's going on?
Kay
Well, I just today is my last day at my current job, which, is super exciting. And I'm starting a new job in July, at this company called Break Away. And it's a music festival company. They have festivals all over the country. You know, the biggest artists like Zedd, Tiesto, Chainsmokers, they're all there. And, I'm coming in as a VP of their media department.
They're starting in July.
Scott
That's amazing. Congrats.
Kay
Thank you. I'm excited because, I mean, I love music festivals in general, and I like working with talent and artists and that kind of stuff. So I think this is going to be a fun switch-up from what I've been doing. So I'm really excited to get that going. But I also have a month off, which I don't know if you guys have had like a month off recently, but people don't usually.
And so I'm like, what am I going to do? What do people do? I don't have any massive plans right now in the month of June. So it's like, I guess I'll just go on some walks, do things during the day. I don't know what that means. You know.
Kwame
It's funny because I was just in Hawaii. Right? So every episode I pick up, like, you know, my thing is I throw on a new hat and a new hoodie. Like, that's my ongoing thing, in case people haven't noticed yet. But anyway, because of that, I always try to put the sneakers that match in the back. And today, as I was thinking about it, I put it on, I started with the sneakers and I was like, what am I going to do with these sneakers?
And obviously I got these crazy colorful ones in the back.
Kay
I saw those are cool.
Kwame
Thank you, thank you. And so I was like, you know what? Let's go with something that I think is symbolic. And obviously I just came back from Hawaii and you and your parents just came back from Hawaii as well. Yeah, yeah. How was that trip? I know now you have a month to go. You have nothing to do in this span of time.
It seems like. What was that experience in Hawaii like? It seems like you were. You were introducing your parents to your social media content.
Kay
Yeah. I mean, my parents. Something about your parents that you kind of have to remember is that they are just starting now to live life, you know, like, because when they were younger, they were having us. They were raising kids and this and that. And it was a much different time and different environment and culture then than it is now.
And so, you know, my parents had never been in a helicopter before. They'd never been since my dad just left the country for the first time last summer. And they spent like a month in Europe. And so they're living life for the first time. So you kind of have to have that patience with them. But also it makes you feel really cool in general, like experiencing these things with them and then seeing all these different places.
But because for us, you know, we're always traveling especially, you know, we're in reality TV or in the media space. You get these experiences that most people don't get to. So bringing my parents into that and watching them have fun was actually the best ever. And I wouldn't have traded that in for anything but super fun.
Scott
Yeah, it's funny now saying I feel like my parents go to cooler places and they're always like, oh, I can't get back to you. I'm on a cruise in Mexico. I was like, why aren't you just in Hawaii? Like two weeks ago? I'm like, I'm in Saint Louis meeting with some random company there.
Kay
Retirement life. Is this crazy?
Scott
Yeah. Now that's awesome. I mean, I think it is fun to be able to share that experience with them, you know, like traveling. It was funny, I, I took my parents did this like a wine tasting thing, with my wife and I. And it was funny because we had the realization that in the last five years since, you know, we had kids, we actually hadn't hung out solo with my parents and just had time to just be adults and connect, and yeah, you know, being able to share experiences like that and things that they wouldn't normally do, it's like you rediscover your parents and like, hey, they're cool.
They can hang out like that.
Kay
Yeah. You don't realize how cool your parents are until you grow up.
Scott
Yeah. For sure.
Kay
Like I remember them, like in my head. You know, when you're a teenager and you're younger, they're super cringe. They don't get it. And now I'm like, oh, they can. They're really cool. We could have been friends this whole time and now, like, obviously I'm really close to them now. But before growing up it was a very different experience.
So I am fully aligned with you on that.
Scott
It's awesome how they like the helicopter tour.
Kay
Oh my God, my parents were like mind blown though I was a bit nervous because I had done helicopters. I've done helicopters in like Vegas and stuff where there's like open space, but we're going through like the Nepali coast and through these mountains and I'm like, oh, all I need is like one little gust of wind and that's it.
So I was a little panicked for a bit, but just watching them take all their pictures, really bad pictures, and really bad videos like nothing was in focus, but they were like, we're getting it. It was very fun.
Scott
That's I don't know, I don't know if your mom is the same way my mom likes the random moment where she just gets really introspective and, like, starts to like saying, I am just so happy to be with you, and like.
Kay
Yes.
Scott
That's awesome. That's super cool.
Kwame
Yeah. you know, I get, you know, getting to share those things with your parents. I've always wanted my mom's not really, like, down for being part of my social stuff. Like, at all. I'm still at some point trying to get her involved in something, so hopefully, it happens. But I think it's really cool that parents get to see that progress of, you know, who you were and who you are.
And obviously, now that social media and personalities are such a big thing, like, I mean, like, you're you're famous person, right?
Kay
And. Oh, please. I'm, I'm, I'm, adjacent. celebrity adjacent. I like it, but not, Yeah. I think me and my co-host Jared, he is one of the funniest people on the planet, but we call ourselves adjacent scum because we're the ones talking about it, you know, recapping everything, doing, like, the roasting of stuff.
So we're not necessarily in it. We're just around it. Reap the benefits without actually having to expose ourselves too much.
Kwame
You know, it's always I feel like people who, how have you and parents ever had, like a recognized moment where, like, you are just walking through the street and someone's like, oh, this is you. Have you had one of those yet?
Kay
Yeah, back home, there was the girl, like, two girls came up to me because they had listened to my podcast and they had been doing it for like six years. So we've built a pretty loyal following, with that. And so that was like a cool moment. But I honestly don't think my parents know what I do.
They don't know how to access the podcast. They don't know. They're like, so where do I listen to it? I'm like, don't worry, you don't need to, don't worry about it. Don't worry about listening to it. I was just talking about The Bachelor. They don't watch The Bachelor. so I don't think they know what I do, but they do like the fact that if we're home or, like, I'll take them and we'll get, like, a free meal somewhere.
If I just, like, make some Insta stories. They love that. They're like, well, can't you just get us, you know, post something about it? They don't know what that means or what that entails, but they think that's just what comes along with it.
Kwame
Yeah. I've, I've had some funny conversations with, you know, we had Jason on, just a couple weeks ago and, he brought up the whole, you know, being famous or kind of having some of the following, like, you get these cool perks. And even his friends chime in occasionally and they're like, oh, like, is this what, like being an influencer is like, you just get a bunch of free stuff, like, I want to do this, you know?
And so yeah, it is really funny because not a lot of people have a lot of insight into what's actually going on that like if I go to a hotel and I do something or I get like a free room, it means I have to like, I don't know, post 3 or 4 times a day and like, take a bunch of pictures and send them, you know, a bunch of the content and blah, blah, blah, like a partnership that gets you something free is actually you're doing a little bit you're doing some work.
Kay
Yeah. You're I mean, it's not. Well, my friends know that if there is something like that involved, if we do get something or a comp dinner, I'm like, FYI, if I need video things, if I need this or that, you got to participate. This isn't like that and you have to know that. All right. We have to take a pause.
We can get this, this, and this, which can kind of be annoying when you're on vacation. Like, that's not really what you want to do, but it's also the easiest thing in the world. So, like, sucking it up and doing it, is worth it. So they know the rules that they might have to be in something, participate.
They have to be in the content. Also, like sometimes I tell them you should also tag people and post some things. Just to give it that extra added value as well. So it makes it look better for me because then all my friends are posting too.
Scott
I definitely benefit from hanging out with Kwami. I know all his angles, so when people stop him I can take the best pictures.
Kay
There we go.
Scott
On the street. That's a.
Kay
Good friend.
Scott
Like, okay, gotcha. Left side, medium-high. Good.
Kay
And that's a good friend.
Scott
It was funny. We got stopped by these folks in Seattle, and it was like a whole baking class, and they literally ran outside and a friend offered their bread to him. And like, oh yeah, it was amazing. It was like the best moment. It felt so good.
Kay
Wait, so Seattle, are you still in Seattle right now?
Kwame
I am in Seattle. Yeah, my wife and I just bought a house, actually.
Kay
Right.
Kwame
Yes. We bought a house in Seattle, so we're like, right on the very edge of, like, Seattle proper. far enough to where we can, you know, venture into the city in 10 or 15 minutes. but also we kind of, like, get that peace in that balance. Like we. Right. We have a deck, which is like having a deck in Seattle is kind of a big deal.
Kay
You've reached the peak. You've reached peak adulthood with a deck.
Kwame
I have, you know what I'm saying. And nowadays I'm very excited when I see, like, Home Depot or Lowe's ads, you know what I'm saying? Because now I'm like, what can I build?
Kay
I know, I actually the reason I ask is because I'm, I do have one thing planned for this month. It's only a few days. But next weekend I'm taking the Amtrak Coastal Starlight from LA to Seattle and I don't know if you know this, but it's like one of the best trains you can take. And it's a 36-hour train from LA to Seattle, like direct.
But it has an observation deck, like, a car where you can see the windows. And so you're going down the coast of the highway. So you see the ocean and all the like, you know, all the nature and stuff. So I got a private room, which I'm gagged at the price of one way, it's like $1,000.
Oh, geez. That's great. I was like, okay, well, this is an experience. I'm doing it by myself. And I'm going up there and I have a friend, a girlfriend meeting me, and we're going to see, like, a Sounders game. But I'm excited to have my own, like, bed and like, table. And I have my own bathroom, shower, the whole thing.
So it'll be a nice experience, but expensive. But I'll let you guys know how it goes.
Scott
I can vouch for that train ride. My wife was living in Seattle when we met, and I was doing Portland in Seattle. We go to Amtrak. It goes by like Chambers Bay. Actually, it's funny, I can see Amtrak. There's, like, the tracks run out by my house here and in Vancouver on the way from Cali, all the way up to Seattle.
Kay
Oh, wow.
Scott
Wave goodbye. Yeah. Now. But it's really convenient that a thousand bucks is wild.
Kay
I mean, it is first class. Like, that's because I bought, like, my own room. Like, it's not that expensive, but because I go to three.
Scott
Hours long.
Kay
Time. Yeah, I don't know how anybody likes sitting in the normal seats for that long. That's torture.
Kwame
Yeah. I mean, to be fair, I used to take the Amtrak from, like, it'd be like Philly or Delaware to, like New York, and it was like almost 200 bucks. So, I think that I am just based on. Yeah, you know what I mean? So based on the length of that journey and a first-class ticket, I think about zero bucks.
Makes sense.
Kay
No influencer perks here. This is raw. Straight out of my pocket.
Kwame
Yeah, this is Kay Brown's hard-earned money.
Kay
This is my hard-earned money. So, I'm excited though. It'll be really, really fun.
Scott
That's awesome. So for our listeners who might not know about the podcast, okay, so you said you've been at it for six years. like, what was that journey like? Like one thing we try to share with our, you know, our audience is like, how do you come up as a creator? How do you get started? How do you navigate all the trials, tribulations, the learnings?
You know, I'm sure in six years you've learned a ton. It has been a crazy experience. You know, maybe walk through that journey and just what was that like?
Kay
Yeah. So, the podcast is called The Bachelor and it's essentially a recap podcast about The Bachelor, Bachelor in Paradise, Bachelorette every week. But we also started incorporating things like Love Is Blind, or other popular shows that might come up, like with time constraints because we can't cover everything. And so maybe it's like if it's off-season, a Bachelor, we can cover Love Is Blind, etc. but I started doing it back in 2018 and end of 2017, beginning of 2018.
And it started out with the three co-founders of batches they turned. We had part of our blog in batches as Bachelor recap articles, which was the biggest thing that we had done. I mean, everybody was reading them, the clicks were crazy. And so we were like, let's turn that into a podcast. They started it, and did it for like a year.
And then, because we started adding so many extra things, I was like, I can take over. And so I brought on one of my best friends, his name is Derek Pace, and he was on the show. And so he was able to give a male perspective, but also, a perspective from somebody who was on it.
And then I had the female fan perspective right there. And, so it became really successful, especially because like our second year to him and I doing it together or maybe second season, he, was actually on Bachelor in Paradise and they allowed him to do the recap podcast as long as he didn't talk about, you know, the behind the scenes, he's only allowed to talk about what was on the screen.
And, the download was just like shot up. And it was so fun and like, building this audience. And now I hosted with this guy named Jared Freed. He has his own Netflix special, 37, single. He's a very funny, massive comedian. And he and I have this great dynamic. I've known him for years. But the thing that has been so rewarding about this and the journey through it is developing this really loyal, like following, not following on Instagram, but like listeners, the people who are invested and actually listening to it.
Like, I don't need to post a link on my Instagram story. They're already on it, you know what I mean? Like, they know it's coming. They get the notification, they know what day it comes out, and they're already messaging me within like an hour of it releasing, being like, oh my God, I just listened. Here are my thoughts. And I think podcasting is such a different experience with your followers, fans, whatever you want to call them because you're not just, hey, here's an Instagram post, or here's a funny video.
Like it? Share it, whatever. It's actually in their head. They have their headphones in there, you're playing it, they're playing it in their car. So you're surrounding their whole like mind, which gives it a very intimate connection, which makes you feel like you're friends with them, you know, everything about their life. And like, I love that closeness that I have with these people.
And then it just makes them even more loyal. They're going to listen to whatever because they feel like they know you and also, one of the biggest things is that you need to respond to DMs and stuff. I know it gets tough and there are a lot of them, but if you take like 30 minutes out of each day and respond to the people who are writing to you, that also brings them closer, because it's not like you're some unattainable person that's just talking to them.
But yeah, let's have a conversation. You have some opinions about like Love Is Blind or The Bachelor or thoughts or theories. I want to hear them and I'll respond back. And I like reading that and it gives it just everything, a better relationship. So I think the journey from the beginning until where we are now has just been so great, because there are people that have been listening since the beginning, and I've even met a lot of them and done weird things.
Like this girl, messaged me because I posted a video. My mom sent me a text. She was like, are you going to Taylor Swift's concert? And I was like, no, I didn't get tickets. And she was like, oh, I thought you would for your connections. And I was like, okay. But it's like the Kris Jenner thing where they're like, why don't you just call Taylor up and you know, that sort of a thing?
And so I posted that as a joke, and this girl messaged me who had been listening forever, and she goes, I have an extra ticket. Do you want to come to Taylor Swift? Me in LA? And I was like, yeah, let's do it. So I went with her and her husband. He drove, we went to Taylor Swift and it was the best time ever.
But she was a complete stranger. Like I did not know her, but it was so much fun. And now we have this, like, great relationship and I think that's what comes with developing, like closeness with the people who are actually listening and investing in you. Because if they're going to invest in you, you should also invest in them.
Scott
I think that's a that's, that's it's amazing for people to hear that. And I do think podcasting is such a powerful format and for the reasons you said, which is, you know, in people's ears, they develop a relationship. The format of the content is, it's not just kind of endlessly scrolling and seeing a flash of someone's face.
It is deep thoughts and a kind of unpacking of emotions. And no matter how you try to hide who you are on a podcast, it's going to come out like the real you. Give it a couple of episodes and it's kind of like, okay, that's, you know, that's Kelly and her true colors. So I'm curious though, like as you came up, you know, you don't have this huge fan base yet.
Or maybe it's the folks who listen to the blog like we're there. As you came up with a quick success, was it kind of a slow burn? Were there moments when you're like, hey, is this worth the energy? Like, I'm curious, in those early days, what was that experience like? Because a lot of creators are starting out, there is a lot of feeling like you're shouting into the void or you don't have followers.
And it's like, should I just bail on this? This is natural. What am I doing? Do you have any of those moments?
Kay
I'm going to be fully transparent with you. because no bullshit. I was working at a media company with producers at a company that already has, you know, 2 million plus followers, very dedicated. So I'm not going to lie to you. It was not as hard as other people trying to come up from nothing or start from scratch, because we already had the followers.
We already had the fan base coming from the articles to this, obviously figuring out how to promote it because, you know, Instagram changes all the time and social media changes all the time. So back then, you didn't know really what the best way to promote a podcast is, like, nobody knew that we needed to have video on all the time.
Like, nobody. We didn't know any of that. So it's definitely like a learning curve that way. But I got very lucky already having the in-house media people, you know, cutting the podcasts, all the sound and everything, putting that together for us. So we would just, you know, do our research, write our outlines, watch the shows every week.
And somebody took care of it. But it was, I mean, it's not. I know it's going to sound crazy to complain about, but it is hard to watch an episode, every week. Not because you're not watching it for fun anymore. You're watching it like I had to think about it. I'm like, okay, she said this. What's funny about this?
How can I turn this into a joke? So it's no longer, oh, let's get together with my girlfriends and watch The Bachelorette. I have to watch this tonight. Please don't talk unless it's commercials, because I have to know what's actually going on. There's people listening, depending on me to do it. And there are days when I can't go out and do things that might like, go to an event because I have to watch The Bachelor.
Scott
They're like, what happened to the fun party Kay? Now she's like, buzzkill. Like, shut up. I have to pay attention.
Kay
What did you say? And no, yeah, I had to take notes and all that stuff. So again, it was much easier because we started off already, with a company that had this traction. But, there are moments where you're like, okay, why didn't this episode do as well? Or if the episodes of The Bachelor aren't very good, we don't have much to say either.
So it kind of depends on that. How many people are watching? There are certain seasons where people aren't really watching anymore. I get so many people saying, I don't watch the show. I just listen to the podcast now, like, I don't need to watch it because you're telling me what happens anyway, which is a cool feeling.
But growing the company though, was difficult because I was like one of the first. I was thinking I was like 7 or 8 in the company and now, you know, they just got acquired by Ladbible. So it's been a massive journey growing that and launching all the podcasts that they have app batches.
Kwame
Yeah, I mean that's quite the journey. I think there are a few things that you brought up, you know, I like to resurface just a little bit when it comes to like your passion becoming like that next that, that next level. I think what a lot of people have to realize is in order to turn your passion into, you know, funds or something that, like, powers you, you know, or something that, like, helps you elevate your career, whatever the case might be like, it takes a considerable like, mind switch to really focus on, you know what I mean?
Like, if you do enjoy it, like, I know, like when I try to start doing more wedding photography and things like that and really wanted to get into photography like it became a bit strenuous, you know, it was like.
Kay
It turns into work. It's no longer it's no longer like, oh yeah, I'll just go shoot this wedding. It's like, oh, I need to shoot this because, like, I'm trying to build it. It's work.
Kwame
Exactly. You know, that transition is huge. When I went from playing soccer for fun to trying to become a pro, it was like, nah, I gotta wake up at 7 a.m. and go for my, you know, five-mile run like it's no longer just like, show up to the park and kick the ball.
Kay
Yeah.
Kwame
You know. Yeah, yeah. And so that is, that is something that people really, really have to like, be considerate of in trying to make something like social media into their career. Like there's a big curve there that you really have to focus on and put a lot of your energy into. And then like what we think about your growth, you know, like how you stepped into, you know, the best podcast and really took off.
And obviously I've been just working at it for quite a while. You've seen a big evolution in the space, like not just podcasting but social media, and yeah, just social media as well. Reality TV, a lot of things have come up. A lot of things have changed. How have you seen your own brand really kind of change as you went along with this?
Kay
Yeah. I mean, I guess my own brand. That's a really good question. I guess my own brand has changed because I sort of left the full-time. I left batches full-time, and I went over. I was working at Gap for three and a half years. And so I went from like this media company where we were growing all the time and this and that to a very corporate world.
And so then I just have like, my podcast is my creative outlet. It's an interesting thing going from having that big backing of a company where you're the face and you do all these different things too. Now I have to work extra hard if I want to grow my social media. And going back to what you were saying with, things evolving and having to when your passion becomes work, because I've always been passionate about social, I've been doing this.
I mean, I was coding my Myspace layouts. I was doing that. This is who I am as a human. It just didn't exist then. And, I don't know, it's just it turned into work. And then I was like, I don't want to do ads on my social media unless I have to, unless it's like great money.
I don't want to do that because I also see the other side of it now as somebody was working on the brand side and I'm like, okay, well, if this person posts something for, say, they post something for Abercrombie, well, Levi's isn't going to work with them now. So you're having to think so much about what goes on your page and then being family is like, what's it called?
Brand safe. So, like, I'm not posting as pictures or anything, but I do curves and I'm partying and I'm doing like, you know, saying all these, like, funny jokes that might not necessarily be brand safe. I don't want to have to limit what I want to post, because, to me, I want this to be fun. I'm already working in it full-time.
I want my stuff to be fun. So I think removing myself from that and being like, this is my fun thing. I'll do ads when I want or like if I feel like it's right or it's, it could be a good experience, I'll do that. But other than that, I kind of shifted away from my own growth, and, I don't really care about it.
I don't know, I'd rather like my podcast be successful or, like, that's what I care about, not necessarily my own. Like, I also get really I mean, I don't know about you guys, but the internet's scary and putting yourself out there, especially as a person who comments on these things like you don't, who knows what everybody's going to talk about.
So I'd rather just listen to the radar with the followers that I have right now who are dedicated and that are cool, that I like, and not have to worry about it. So I've kind of taken it. I've taken a step back from doing my own social media work.
Scott
I love what you said and so much of it resonates with a lot of conversations. I mean, I have started a podcast. We also have a media company come back and shout out to David. The editor is amazing and the whole team likes it, but you know, there's elements of putting yourself out there. There is. What will the internet think? I think there is.
Kay
That's why you can't find my last name anyway. Yeah okay. Sorry. Go ahead.
Scott
No it's very real and trying to navigate, public perception like trying to be funny, but then also like I'm supposed to be CEO of this company and, and make sure that we're showing up really well. And, you know, I mean, I talk a lot. How do we make it fun? How do we make it interesting?
How do we, we don't want to create highly controversial content, probably. I don't know, but it's interesting because I think, you know, you sacrifice some viewership potentially, or some attention, but you do it in a way that you're proud of, the way you want to show up, the way you want to engage with your audience. And so but it's yeah, it's, it's really interesting.
And then trying to dissociate, you know, your own social media or follower count. And I think what reassures me is the things that you mentioned, which are the moments when people reach out and they say that they're really appreciated or inspired by something or it made their day better. or when particular guests reach out and they want to come on and you're like, wow, this person wants to come on our podcast.
Yeah. You know, it's an amazing feeling. And I, I think it helps balance some of those, you know, the nerves, the trade-offs, all those things you have to decide I, I'm curious like, do you have do you feel like you have the support of, or you had the support of gap, I guess. And, you know, as you go into this new job, you are a creator, you have your podcast, you have all this stuff going on.
It's really difficult to balance. Do you feel like that's easy for you to navigate? Is it hard do you feel like you're making trade-offs or having to communicate really well to make sure people feel like time is well spent?
Kay
Honestly, the gap was like the best experience because from the beginning I, you know, I was talking to the hiring manager, the recruiter who was negotiating all the stuff, and I was like, has everybody seen my social? Because I'm not going to be one of those people that go private or like, are afraid to post things just because, you know, they work at a certain company.
And this and I was like, I just want to make sure we're on the same page. And I was like, and I have a podcast. They do it. I do it at 7 a.m. before work hours. So I'm not disrupting work hour time. So they have me, for the full eight hours every day. so they've always I've never heard one thing about it.
Never one thing that was like, hey, can you not post this or, why are you in makeup today? And it's like, well, because I had an interview this morning, you know, that sort of thing. Nobody's ever said anything about that, which is really nice. And I think if you are going to start a podcast or be in this realm, but also try to be, you know, girl boss, I feel like you need to make sure that the company that you're working for, like be super transparent upfront because if you lay down the law up front, then is what it is.
They agreed to it. They knew what they were signing up for in the end. And then this other job, breakaway that I'm going to be going to is great because I'm going to be hosting a podcast with them. They want me to be very much face-forward. It's a music festival, so it's all about fun. I'm a music festival girl and this is part of the job.
They know I have my other podcast they know, and again, I'm never going to have that get in the way of what's, that, their job. The job that I'm doing for them. So it's, I think it's just finding that right balance and making sure that you're doing what you need to do to make sure your full-time job isn't, being hindered, but also that you're able to, like, do your other passions because I think that's important, too, if you're not allowed, if they're not able to do other things in your job, what the are we doing?
You know. Yeah, yeah. That's insane. Like, I can't just sit at a computer on Zoom all day, and then you expect me to just only think about that now?
Scott
I think that's a great lesson for creators who work and just people in general. I think you've hit on something. There's so much dialogue around work-life balance or having outside interests and, you know, at the end of the day, it's communication and setting out clear expectations of these are the commitments I have. This is the life that I live.
I have kids, I have hobbies, I play sports, I have other things. And, you know, clearly communicate. Communicating is leadership and this is what my expectations are. Let's meet in the middle and let's make sure that we can both, you know, be happy and productive and get the most out. Because if you weren't able to succeed in your podcast, you felt like you had to give up a part of yourself.
You're not going to give it to her. You're not going to show up and you're going to resent that, or you're probably gonna leave. And so I make all of that point not to make it about, you know, corporate life, but I do think a lot of creators work and have jobs, and they probably struggle with how they're spending their time and resentment and all this.
And so I think finding someone who supports you communicating, well, it's it's, something everyone probably could get better at.
Kay
Yeah. I've been very lucky with that, with, with gap and with, breakaway obviously. So I'm very excited and everybody does that. Just make sure that they know. And, if they don't like it, then you'll find somewhere else.
Kwame
Yeah, yeah. I mean, there is a good balance between, you know, your personal brand and how you present yourself and all these things. I think an interesting part about when I became a public figure was I did, I will admit, like, I toned myself down a tiny bit. I thought it was necessary because I'm pretty. I like to try to think I'm funny, you know what I mean?
So I consistently yeah, I consistently put out more just like big energy content back in the day. And I feel like, once I became more of a public figure, I felt like I had to tone it down a little bit to kind of appeal to the audience that I had, because, you know, you obviously know your audience analytics and, my, my 96% women following is not going to be just as excited about the things that I used to share with, like, you know, me and my guy friends typically.
And so there's an interesting balance of that. And so finding a way to marry those two is absolutely essential to being like, I would say happy, you know. Yeah. You can't, you can't give up yourself completely. You do have to hang on to those things. So I'm trying to find this happy reemergence spot of just being jovial, still being consistently just like laughing and jockey, but also being socially conscious of the things that are around me.
Kay
I mean, just to even, like, challenge that a little bit, I would be your audience. I see people, I see a lot of influencers. They're like, what do you guys want to see more of who what? Last time I checked, this is my page. So I'm going to post whatever I want to post because then I'm not. I don't feel like I have to be okay, what am I going to do?
What am I going to put on my story today? I'm just going to do whatever I usually post on my story. What I like to do naturally. If you're doing what you naturally do, you never have to, feel like you're working at it. And then at the same time, it's like, I would rather have a smaller following that's like, you know, hardcore fans or friends or whatever that actually, like myself, no matter what I post than people who are going to be like, no, I want this instead, or blah, blah, blah.
It's like, we can do both. But at the end of the day, it's your page. It is your Instagram, it is your TikTok. You should post what you want to post because they shouldn't dictate that for you. I get I understand wanting to like, give them that and you can, but at the end of the day, it's your page.
Scott
I'm glad you said that. As she was saying. I was saying that you know, I obviously see all of comics content and, you know, the most in during that. You are the most that people like, see the real me. And it's like wandering through Trader Joe's and being like, I don't understand what's going on with this thing, or like rapping on the street.
It's letting your goofy out. Like, we know you're goofy, but you like, I don't think you need to hold that back. And I love that, you know, just being you and not not worrying about it. I do think that the people who love you and love you, who for you are like, I just think, let that out. So I love that advice.
I love that you call that out because I think more people need to just say, hey, be boo. That's okay. Whatever that means. And the people who are following you, if they like you for you, they're going to hang around and the people that discover you, it's going to be authentic. It's going to be real.
Kay
I mean, people come for the content. They say for the personality. Yeah. Your personality is your Instagram story. Your content is whatever's on your grid. They come for your content, they stay for your personality. They like you, they're staying. And so, like, put on glamor. You're funny, you're fun. Who cares? Yeah. You know, dig it.
Kwame
You have a great personality.
Kay
Also, I wasn't trying to throw shade at you at all. I was just being, like. Like, everybody feels happy.
Kwame
Nah, I know you're not.
Kay
I love sending you. Honestly. Yeah.
Scott
We're gonna see a whole new Colombia next week. Just wait. The emerges from his shell and goes full.
Kay
You go rogue.
Scott
no. It's gonna be like country Garth Brooks or something. Or. You know what? He here's, like, when he came out as, like, a pop artist, like, randomly.
Kay
You never know.
Kwame
well, well, you know, the shameless plug. I mean, since you're transitioning over to your, your music festival, you know, role, just keep in mind, I will be releasing an EP at some point, so, you know.
Kay
I guess you need to.
Kwame
Any new artists?
Kay
Wait. That's awesome. Yeah.
Kwame
Yeah, I did this, took a Crap a beat thing with a guy I connected with online, and it was just.
Kay
I feel like I did see this.
Kwame
Yeah. Right. Yeah. And so when I, when I did, like, I did it for fun, obviously. And then I threw it out to my audience and said, hey, would you all like, listen to, I don't know, a song if I put out a song and, you know, 91% of my audience said yes. And I was excited about that.
Right. So I put out a little note that said that, like, I would like to, you know, put out something. Is there any way that I can grab, you know, like, people to work with me? What? There's a cop at my door. Hold on. This is so random. Give you one second. You should notice that I'm talking on a mic once that.
Kay
A cop.
Scott
Just got spicy.
Kay
I have so many questions, but…
Kwame
No no no no no, I feel like you all said something juicy and I missed it.
Kay
No, nothing. Nothing juicy.
Scott
Are you getting a lot of questions? You need to go away for a while.
Kay
Yeah.
Kwame
This is actually this is the part that I was telling you about that I was hiding the whole time.
Kay
I'm surprised I'm under arrest.
Kwame
Oh, man. Talk about timing. yeah. My alarm went off earlier because we have a motion detector in the ADT. Told me that my dog is so small, that it would never get caught on the motion detector. And, yeah, I got a motion detector, and obviously he's just like, he's scurrying around the house, and now he's just laying there like he's the man he loves, waking me up and then going to sleep.
But anyhow, back to the conversation.
Kay
Yeah.
Kwame
Yes, where were we?
Kay
You're telling me about how you just asked your followers. Oh, you should listen to the song.
Kwame
Yes. Okay, cool. So yeah, I asked a bunch of my followers if they would listen to the song and 91% said yes. And then I put out kind of like a, you know, a bat signal to say that, hey, you know, like, would anybody want to do it, you know, start a project with me. And I was really lucky because a couple of producers reached out and then, a girl who sang on a girl who's actually just on the voice.
Oh, wow. I could. Yeah. Connected with her as well. She connected me with another producer, and so I'm like, you know what? Let's just go all out. We're only going to do this one time. You know, like, I'm not going to just do something, like, just kind of show up to someone's house and record a song for 15 minutes and then leave.
It's like, if we're going to do something, let's put the most into it. Make like a 2 or 3-song situation and then drop it and then just exit if we want to, you know what I mean? And like a feel-good project, like we spent some time on it. It was a passion project. We did it. And then, whatever happens, happens.
Kay
See, that's really cool. And also at the same time, the reason why 91% said yes is because they like you. You know what I mean? It's because they like you as a person. And one of the things that I've seen a lot coming up with, influencers and creators and etc. is, people who show the process like, founders, like CEOs of their own things, showing them doing, coming up with their product, being like, okay, we're coming out with this is how I'm making it.
This is how I'm like the process of creating this entire brand and you end up liking that person. So you're automatically going to want the product because you like them. They're going to support you because they like what you're putting out because I like you. So they're going to whatever you're putting out, they're going to take. And so I think that's a really great way to take away from the fact that they liked you.
So they want your music. So, you know, keep going with that. I think that's what it is. And like you can also do the behind-the-scenes of the process or do little vlogs of like okay day in the life of recording an EP. And I think that's just, that's what makes a lot of these like smaller brands that are coming up on TikTok, etc. successful is because people like the person doing it.
Scott
Yeah, I think, I think it's a great point too. And I like the whole point about sharing who you are and being genuine. I think once you have that following of people who really enjoy you and what you represent, it does make all of those kinds of adjacent things that you do, easier to go because these people come on the journey with you.
I think about, Mark Rober, who obviously has like 25 million followers. He's like a science YouTuber. Yeah, he created Crunch Labs, and then he created, like, a huge charitable giving campaign with Mr. B's for, like, planting trees. They raised, I don't know, $50 million or something.
Kay
Like that, but.
Scott
It's so many people like him. What he stands for is education and putting kids first. He's actively talking about his son with autism, and he's just like a great dude. And anything he does, you're like, I want to support him. He's yeah, he stands for the right things and he makes really funny and cool content at the same time.
So I love that. I think. Yeah, letting people in on who you are builds lifelong customers no matter what you're.
Kay
Putting and they trust you, they're going to trust you because they're seeing it happen.
Scott
Yeah.
Kay
Because why would you? Why would you record all this and put out all this? But it is not real.
Kwame
So yeah, yeah, yeah I can dig that. And you know so okay as we kind of wrap things up and I think what was really cool about this conversation is, you know, we have this entire list of questions we would want to ask if we didn't like, we didn't get through anything because we would just be having a conversation.
And you were just giving us the raw you and that's what the people want. And so I do love that. But there are a couple of things I want to make sure that we touched on before.
Kay
Yeah.
Kwame
before we get out of here, question number one for you is, as someone who is now probably partnered with a bunch of, organizations or companies or whatever you want to call it, some brands, you know, have you ever had a partnership, or kind of a little campaign that you've done that was just like, you really loved them.
Really remember?
Kay
Yes. immediately I worked with Taco Bell, and not only are they, if you haven't seen their marketing, it's a ten they are out of. They think out of the box. Everything is funny. Everything is very relevant. They use relevant people. They do relevant things. I think their marketing in general is some of the best I've seen.
And I think it was two years ago and 20, 22. If you're not a fan of the Mexican pizza from Taco Bell, I was and I tweeted about Taco Bell like a billion times, but they decided they took it off the menu and there was this whole, like, outrage all over the internet about removing the Mexican pizza.
And they were like, okay, oops, so let's bring it back. But in a cool way. And so what they did was, they partnered with Doja Cat and Dolly Parton and they did, TikTok, Mexican pizza. The musical. And it was the first ten-minute TikTok that you could watch on TikTok. It was the first ten minutes, and it was a full-blown musical recorded on an iPhone, with a whole cast.
It was like a Broadway show. They had the two girls who wrote the music for Bridgerton The Musical on TikTok in 2020, right? The music. They also just wrote the music for the new Moana coming out on Disney. They're like 20-something. They're like 22, 23 years old. Yeah, I mean, they're incredible. Like beyond. They also won a Grammy for Bridgerton, the Musical.
Wow, that was just on TikTok. It wasn't even a real show. Yeah. So that's how they got them. And they asked me to be part of it because fun fact, I'm a musical theater major and I was doing musicals my whole life professionally, etc. before I got into media and so I got to be in and I was like, what?
I'm like the principal cast members and we recorded this, for I think it was three days in New York, and the woman who recorded it was like the original, like someone shot on an iPhone person. So she recorded this entire thing on her iPhone and it was unbelievable. It was so much fun. And you had Dolly Parton in it.
Doja Cat was in it. the guy who made the original TikTok that went viral for the Mexican pizza going away. He was in it. It was the coolest thing ever. And it was so successful. Honestly, again, Taco Bell, if you have a chance to work with them tonight, I would recommend it.
Scott
Yeah, shout out to Taylor. Taylor Montgomery over at Taco Bell. It was, he's the CMO over there. It was funny. My buddy just sent me there. They launched, like, a crunch wrap with them of, like, ten times larger than normal Cheez-It inside of it. And I was like, these guys, whatever you think about Taco Bell, their marketing team goes so hard.
Kay
Fact about the cheese is that they brought it to me over a year ago. They invited a few of us. Oh, they invited all of us who were in the music hall, who lived in LA, and they flew a lot of people out to the Taco Bell headquarters in Irvine. And we gotta go there, and we did a whole, like, tasting thing.
And one of them was the Cheez-It, Cheez-It. crunchwrap. But we weren't allowed. We signed an NDA. We weren't allowed to talk about it. but we tried it like a year ago. And so they finally came out. I was like, that's crazy.
Scott
Like, never in your childhood dreams are you like, I'm going to be an early taste tester under NDA, eating a contract with a like an oversize.
Kay
Imagine or listen to people.
Scott
Or in a Taco Bell musical.
Kay
No. Yeah. The people who save the sauce packets are the backbone of our country. I'm just saying.
Scott
The team miles us.
Kay
Yeah, I like the hot, but I like the mild flavor of the mild. Anyway, we've got a hot topic to talk about. Honestly, it was the best. Was the best collaboration that I've ever done.
Kwame
I love it. and then segway to you've done a fantastic collaboration with Taco Bell. Now, obviously you are very experienced in your brand collaborations. You do awesome things. So if there was a brand out there that you could tap on the shoulder and say, hey, I'd love to work with you, who would that be?
Kay
Wow, that's a really good question. I would have to say, oh, it's I guess, yeah, it's a brand I would want to do Duolingo. Sorry, but that also is like peak marketing. And it's not because people are downloading the app, but now they know about it. You know, Duolingo. I say it like you like, it doesn't mean you're actually using it, but you know about it.
And that's incredible. And I think their marketing team is so good as well. I would love to do something with Duolingo.
Scott
Yeah. Those guys, they're, their social media is amazing. I'm trying to remember her name. They had a social gathering over there. Was it, social media week? And she said this. There's so much they did, like this whole BBL campaign. Oh, gosh. It's so funny.
Kay
What they think of everything. And they jump on things right away and it's so smart, man. I wish more companies did stuff like that and just chilled out on the fact that they feel like they need to be serious and just be fun. People just want to be entertained or educated and that's that.
Scott
It is funny thinking about brands pivoting from just this traditional like, let me show you the features and benefits of my products. Let me show you, that aspirational athletes doing great things. I think, like, you know, seeing a running ad or someone falling down an ice or something would probably like to get more entertainment and views and be more endearing to people at this point.
So it's interesting how that whole landscape has shifted from trying to pump yourself up and be super professional versus now it's like, how do we entertain? How do we engage? How do we make people love the brand versus just thinking we're aspirational?
Kay
Also, Marc Jacobs, marketing is beyond Marc Jacobs is a ten out of ten. Their stuff is really unhinged. And like, you don't even know it's an ad. You're like, why is little Uzi Vert sitting in Marc Jacobs' office just on the computer? What do you? I'm confused, but I'm engaging. I'm watching. And then I see it's a Marc Jacobs ad.
Everything they do is also very, very good.
Kwame
Awesome. Well, Kay. Kay York City, Kay Brown. Kay it's the last one.
Kay
Kay California.
Kwame
California. is the talent of many names. but only one has a genuine, amazing personality. So, okay, we thank you so much for joining us today on Beyond Influence. We learned a ton from you. and as I said, we wanted to touch on a couple of things, but it's even better when we just get to go with what's going on because it means we're just having a good time and we're just learning from you.
So, thanks again for taking the time out and joining us. Thank you everybody today for tuning in. Hopefully, you enjoyed it like we did. And, we're excited. Once again, thank you.
Kay
And thank you guys.
Kwame
Yeah for sure. We will see everybody next week.
Scott
So next one.