Transcript
Oops! Our video transcriptions might have a few quirks since they’re hot off the press. Rest assured, the good stuff is all there, even if the occasional typo slips through. Thanks for understanding.
Kwame
What's up everybody? Welcome to today's episode of Beyond Influence. We have a not, you know, never happening but rare occasion of Kwame solo episode. And so I'm excited because I get to talk to somebody who I feel like I have a very good flow of conversation with is just going to be bro on bro, fam on fam, homie on homie, having a good conversation.
Kwame
So I'm excited today to have with me then Baton over. And how are you doing today man.
Vin Matano
I'm doing good man. Just trying to get back into the swing of things ever since coming back from ten.
Kwame
Yes, of course you are, man. Everybody is. Everybody's super busy. It just seems like a ton of catching up. And just for the, for the crowd, for the people, for the audience, for anybody who tunes in. I know we're going to open up a lot more can, but I just want to tell them a little bit about who you are, man.
Kwame
Can you give us a little bit of a background for sure?
Vin Matano
Yeah. So, my name is Vin. I run a B2B influencer marketing agency called Crater Buzz, and we just hit our one year as of June, so that's pretty exciting. And prior to that, I was in B2B SAAS for the past six years. I also am a creator, which is how I got into the business. So I was creating a lot of content about my job in tech sales, which I know you know all too well, and started working with a lot of tech brands and doing the first few partnerships on LinkedIn as a creator, you know, three years ago or so.
Vin Matano
And that's really how I got into the business.
Kwame
That's super dope, man. And it's brought you here. It's really funny because, like when you think about the landscape of creators and who people know, you know, I'm, we're over at Cannes. We're you know, putting out stories, and I put out a story of, like, meeting you. And one of my. One of my love is blind.
Kwame
You know, started, you know, at costars or whatever you want to call it, from one of our seasons reaching out and, Johnny McIntyre, and he's like, yo, I love this guy. I've been following his content. And it's so funny, this massive spider web of people who digest each other's content. So that was really cool. He's from, you know, he used to work in the B2B world and now he's full time creating.
Kwame
So I'm very happy for him. And obviously I used to work at, you know, zoom and phone and you used to work at do you mention the company's name?
Vin Matano
Yeah. Demandbase. Yeah. I was there for six years. And, that's really how I got my whole start. And it's funny, like you mentioned, your, your your friend, like, had recognized me, and I definitely don't. I'm not the biggest creator by any means, but I was making content in such a specific niche in tech sales that by default, anyone that was in tech sales like that was to me, it was like, you know, you know, there was a good chance that they may have seen at least one of my videos.
Vin Matano
So it was always funny. I'd go to conferences and I was like, I shouldn't be recognized. But sometimes I do, and it's pretty crazy, I don't know.
Kwame
Yeah. You know, I think one thing that I really respect about the B2B creator space is like the lack of saturation right now. Yeah. You know, it's like right now, if you are a consistent B2B creator, you really, really stand out. When I first got into the creator world, I didn't even know I was in the creator world because I was working at zoom Info, and I was just sharing the stories about what I was doing through my day to day.
Kwame
When I like, like when I feel like you're someone who is just inspired at work. Yeah, you tend to share a lot and you know, you're on LinkedIn and you're talking about your day, and sometimes you create a video, sometimes you're talking and it just creates this really cool sense of community. Because when you're on a platform like LinkedIn, it becomes a significantly more shared experience because it's so niche, right?
Kwame
When you put something out into the world, there's billions of people and they have so many different examples that I feel like you may not be relating to as close an audience, but when you are on LinkedIn, you know that you are, you know, primarily in, you know, the the corporate world or even in other spaces, you know, that the people who follow you or the people you are connected to are in the corporate world.
Kwame
And so it definitely creates a sense of community that is really, really interesting. And it's really flourishing, man. It's really awesome to see. So, you know, obviously now you are very heavily focused in that B2B creator space. Oh yeah. Why did you like, you know, why did this stick out to you when you initially started?
Vin Matano
Well, you, you hit the nail on the head like I started creating content mostly on LinkedIn. I started just sharing stuff about my day to day job in sales. And I started to notice that there were a bunch of other people that were like me that were building really small audiences, but the small audiences were really valuable to the right company.
Vin Matano
All of the people that followed me at one point in time were all salespeople. So if you are a sales tech company, like a Zoominfo, for example, it'd be pretty wise maybe to put some of your marketing budget towards a creator like myself. And you know, I look at my other creator friends who are getting brand deals on TikTok and Instagram and YouTube.
Vin Matano
And I was a little envious of them, of like the opportunities they were getting. And I always had this hypothesis back and I think it was like 2019. I had some cold emails that I was sending to, was it a latte or, a sauna and companies like that where I'm like, oh, I can do a brand deal for them on LinkedIn.
Vin Matano
And so I always had this thought early on that, like, LinkedIn will become a platform where brand deals are happening and more so supporting the tech space and, specifically. And then once I got my first brand deal, I think it was 20, I think it was 20, maybe 2019 or 2021. Around that time, it was like $200 for a post.
Vin Matano
And that was like the confidence to be like, okay, the tides are changing here. And, I was working with a few brands on the side while I had my 9 to 5 job at Demand Base, and that was enough for me to say, okay, there's people who are paying or willing to pay for this service. And, just went in one day, decided, like, I'm going to quit my job and start this business, like, without any planning to have a name or a website or bank account or nothing in place and, document my whole journey ever since.
Kwame
That's super cool, man. And obviously you've gotten so far now that you are being sent to Cannes, or at least at Cannes with a brand. Oh, yeah. And so before we dive too deep into all of how that happened, let's dive into Cannes itself, man. How was that experience last week? Was it last week or two weeks ago or whatever it was?
Kwame
It was super cool. I feel like all my time is all in disarray right now. But yeah, man, I was kidding.
Vin Matano
I mean, it was awesome. It was. It blew my mind. I, I think most people I don't know if you can relate to this. I didn't actually know what it was like. I knew there was a film festival, did not know there was a separate festival for marketing.
Kwame
Yeah.
Vin Matano
So that was like I learned about that. And then I actually did a lot of research on it because I was just curious about it. And so it was an event that started in the 50s, I think it was like 1954, and it was basically a spinoff of the film festival, the focus on advertising film.
Vin Matano
And it started in Venice, in Venice, Italy, and it became this very prestigious event, where, like the top advertisers would be their top publishers. But now what we're seeing is that a lot of these companies' advertising budgets are now going towards creators, and there's this really kind of big overlap of creators and advertisers. It's kind of like a little bit of a changing of the guard where the old school advertisers, I mean, you saw I can see that all the companies that had beachfront access were all big tech companies, and they were paying creators.
Vin Matano
They're bringing creators and doing all these interesting things. And all the publishers were like, you. I mean, I didn't even see any of them. I heard they were like, push way off back. So it was really great. Great creators to connect with, executives are there to connect with top brands. There were really fun activations and everything.
Kwame
Did you know can was though can was really amazing. I was just talking to one of our leaders about it right before this conversation. Man, I think there's a few things that you have to understand about going into it. Well, first thing is it's kind of like keeping up with the Joneses for a lot of these brands and companies.
Kwame
I feel like I want to have the biggest thing. And so it's really important to keep that in mind. Like you said, it really is very high level, very prestigious, you know. Yeah. But with that being said, there are opportunities for everyone to experience some of that glamor. It's some of that luxury which I think is really cool now.
Kwame
Right. Because now that a lot of companies are shifting their ad dollars towards the creator, you know, commerce and creator space and influencer marketing, they're inviting creators in to show the world this. And I think what's really cool about it is you don't have to be this 500,000 follower, 1 million follower, creator. I was meeting creators who were brought there by some of the biggest companies out there, the metas, the Snapchat, you know, the Adobes who may only have 15, 20, 50,000 followers.
Kwame
Right. And I feel like it makes that feel a lot more inclusive. So I thought it was really cool, man. And obviously I got to see 50 cent, which I thought was really cool. I got to preview these guys, you know what I'm saying? So you can't complain. What would you say is your favorite thing that you experience when.
Vin Matano
Well, I'm so jealous of that because I, if 55 is like one of my favorite artists, whenever I close the deal, I play hustler's ambition every single time. Nice. And so yeah, I'm jealous about that. I saw Jason The Rule of Concert, which I don't think is as cool. However, it was still a good time. Now, my my favorite part about, can I think was, honestly, the presence of the tech companies.
Vin Matano
And I always feel that being a tech creator or B2B creator or knowledge creator or whatever you want to call us, we're kind of like the ugly stepchild or whatever that saying is. We're like, we're always forgotten. It's always like the mainstream, like consumer focused creators that are always getting invited to the course events. They're at Coachella, they're at all these cool things.
Vin Matano
And the B2B creators, the tech creators, like, I feel like we didn't have our thing. That was really reputable and cool and exclusive. And I feel like can is becoming that, at least because a lot of the tech, like you said, a lot of tech companies were bringing creators like us there. And so that was the most eye opening thing to me.
Vin Matano
I mean, I'm betting my entire business on this whole idea of B2B influencer marketing. And so I can just in general validate that for me. And then, of course, like meeting with other people, I think one of my favorite sessions was with Tom and Samir, like about how to get really specific, but that's just my nine core takeaways.
Vin Matano
But I'm curious what were your highlights?
Kwame
Yeah. You know, that is I think that's a really, really important thing that you said that. Right. Like you are, you are betting your business on what this belief is about B2B creators. And I feel like validation is a really big thing when you see people in high positions, validating what you are saying or, you know, putting some thought behind it or wanting to know more about it, it is such an incredible experience and an eye opening experience and a validation experience.
Kwame
And, yeah, I think that that's a really cool component. I mean, for me, I really loved that you could not walk a block without seeing someone who was, you know, either important or somebody who you look up to or admire or someone who's worked really hard in their career, to get where they are. I just think it was a place that really cultivated motivation and excitement, you know, and, and in all industries as well.
Kwame
Right. When I became a soccer player, when I really got into soccer, you know, watching the US soccer at the age that I was, I used to watch a guy called Jozy Altidore, right, who was the forward for the US men's team. And I ran into him at an airport like a few years ago.
Kwame
And I remember like, well, you know, this is after my love is blind experience. And so like, I, I kind of had the feeling of what it was like to be approached out in public and like he was on the phone. And I was like, at that moment, I was like, damn. Like, if I was on the phone at the airport, I might not want to be approached.
Kwame
But I was like, I got to catch my flight and I just have to say something to him. So I walked up to him and I was like, hey, man, like, I'm really sorry about this. But like, you know, I'm just such a big fan. I wanted to do this myself. And he, like, he got off the phone call.
Kwame
He's like, hey, I'm gonna call you back and spoke and spoke to me, and we took a picture. And then we connected on Instagram. Later, I think a day or two later, I saw him at one of the first events that I went to, and we just chatted for a while. We chatted for about 30 minutes about any and all things, he gave me his number and then.
Vin Matano
This cool man.
Kwame
You know? Yeah. And I was like, you know, hey, I'll follow up at some time. And then this is when I was like, all right, this place has such a special energy. I am like, it's our last night. Everybody's last night. They stay out as late as they possibly can because they want to experience as much of camp before they get on their flight.
Kwame
So I'm up until I think my flight is at 7:30 or so. So I start heading home from the bar at like five. Yeah, I'm like, I'm good. Everything's, you know, put together. I can just throw some stuff in my bag and I'm good to go. I pretty much knew, like, I, I timed it out. I knew if I got home by 530, I'd be fine.
Kwame
I'm walking home. I think actually it might have been like 4:30 or so because I spent some time here, but about 4:30 I'm walking home and lo and behold, in front of me I see Jozy Altidore walking home as well. Right. And we have I'm like Jose. And he's calm. And we stop. And this is at 4 or 5 in the morning.
Vin Matano
Wow.
Kwame
Right. Seeing 121 of the guys that I idolize most we had a brief conversation at one event. But we stopped here and at five in the morning we had like a 30 minute conversation. Right. And he was telling me all the ideas and all the connections and all the conversations that went on. And Kenny's like, this place is just electric.
Kwame
Right. You meet so many incredible people, you learn so much from them and I'm like, tell me about it. Right. We're literally speaking at this moment and I feel the same way being in your presence. Right. And so that was what had to be my favorite thing.
Vin Matano
That to me that's a great story.
Kwame
Or a great story. Yeah. It's so cool. So yeah, I just think there's so much, like there's so much opportunity at can. Right? You can run into the right person at the right time. And I feel like, you know, obviously it costs a lot to get out. But if you were ever thinking about positioning yourself in a way where you are starting a business or you are trying to get into a certain industry and you want to meet the right people when it comes to the ad space or the influencer marketing space, or the technology space, go to care.
Vin Matano
Oh yeah. Yeah it is. It is quite expensive to get out there too, though, like you said. So like, yeah. You know, I think there's ways where you can kind of budget it I think. Yes. I don't think you necessarily need to buy the passes. It is like one of the most expensive things I think without any discounts.
Vin Matano
I think the pass is like four grand. Yes. Which is insane. And I know a lot of people that went to the conference without even buying the pass because there's so much going on outside of it. So like, you could essentially not buy the pass. You could stay outside of Cannes, like I stayed outside in this area called Belarus, which is like ten, 15 minutes outside of Cannes.
Vin Matano
And you can kind of budget it if you really, really want to just, like, make it there. And of course, if you have maybe a small following or you are a creator, you can definitely approach any of the brands. So what I did, honestly, I didn't have any plans to go to Cannes until like two weeks before the conference.
Vin Matano
Oh wow. So I went to the Cannes, some few of the Cannes like website links, and I saw the sponsors and I had some connections from some of the sponsors that were listed there. So I just DM'd some of the sponsors and I was like, hey, you know, I saw you going to Cannes. I would love to do some activations there with you.
Vin Matano
One of the brands was like, hey, we can't like to fly anyone out, but if you're going to be there, like maybe we'll do some content. And so I'm like, I'm there, you know, I'm there, I don't know anything. But yeah, but I was like, I'm there. So that worked out. And then another one literally I, I signed a contract the day before my flight, actually the morning of my flight, with another one that I just saw was was out there and I said, hey, I would love to do maybe some, like, street interviews for you and, can give you the street interviews.
Vin Matano
And that's another way where you can maybe, like, help financially just to get you out there.
Kwame
Wow, I see, I love that, I love the hustle and the grind. I think that those are important things for people to know that it's like, if you really want an opportunity to do these things, you can't wait on them, all right. You got to go searching for them. And there are definitely a lot of ways to make it happen.
Kwame
Right when you were, if I may ask, when you were, you know, you had connections in certain places, but let's just say within title role and space and vertical. Who were you reaching out to when you decided to reach out to these companies?
Vin Matano
As a creator? I would. So, for example, I would first look to see who's like attending the event. Who's sponsoring the event. Then I would go to LinkedIn. I use LinkedIn Sales Navigator, but you can probably do it without LinkedIn Sales Navigator. You can look up influencer marketing managers, social media managers. If it's a really small company, you could probably just go right to the top person, the CMO or something like that.
Vin Matano
Yeah. And you could just I would just I would send them an email just saying like, hey, so you're a sponsor or attending can like if you if you're an aspiring creator or if you're already a creator yourself, I think going if you're not a creator, you can always go like the UGC route where it's like, hey, I can help create some street interviews for you in exchange for, you know, X amount of dollars, whatever you deem right.
Vin Matano
Or maybe it's in exchange for the conference pass or whatever, whatever is right for you. But if you already have an audience of course, just give them some of your examples of what you might do at the activation and definitely like to attend anything that they throw in your highlights in their videos and things like that.
Vin Matano
So you can get super creative, super scrappy. Like I said, I didn't have my trip planned until two weeks before the conference. And like it is, it's very much possible to do that.
Kwame
Yeah, I think that's an important thing to mention. I think that that is something that escapes a lot of people in terms of just like the realm of knowledge of the industry is you don't have to have a big following to make content for someone.
Vin Matano
Oh, no.
Kwame
Yeah, right. You can train yourself to be social media savvy and understand how to create content without creating it on your own platform. I know people who make six figures just making user generated content. Yeah, without having a big following. Right? Because they're diligent about it. They reach out to companies, they get all the perks of being a creator without having to actually, you know, worry about their own platform or the way that they engage within their own community.
Kwame
And so I think that that's a big thing that a lot of people don't know about. You can reach out to content companies and ask to make content on behalf of them without having your own platform. So keep that in mind. That's a really important gem. Thanks for sharing that van. I think that's a really important one.
Kwame
So, we're going to go a little bit, I guess like a little bit deeper here, right, to talking about a few things that come with the content creation and why you thought you were confident enough to transition from being in corporate America. Right? So if you could for me, I'd love to talk about the first brand deal you ever got.
Kwame
Well, I guess the first that you ever got, and then the brand deal that you got that made you think, okay, I can maybe do this for a living.
Vin Matano
Yeah. So the first brand deal I got definitely did not make me think I could do this for a living. I was like other people. I was like, how are people full time creators? Because the first brand was like $200 and I was like, man, I have to do so many of these.
Kwame
Yeah.
Vin Matano
So that was just, I think, opening, eye opening just to say, oh, someone's willing to pay me, but it wasn't by any means something where I was like, oh, I'm going to be. And by the way, I'm not a full time creator now. So they created content. I do now as part time, and all the content I do now is really like to fuel the business.
Vin Matano
Like all of my income and everything comes from the business. But I am definitely still a creator. I do actively brand deals each month and stuff like that. So I just want to be clear there. Okay. The one I would say, like the one brand deal I did get, that was pretty eye opening, was like the first time I worked with, like, a major tech brand.
Vin Matano
It was like a $9,000 brand deal. And it was for. I think it was for, like, three videos. And that happened probably three years into my 3 or 4 years into my content journey. So I took a long time, like, okay, I by no means had like, is explosive growth like I'd never had any viral videos. It was always just this very slow up until the right like growth.
Vin Matano
And it's still that way. Like I don't have any crazy viral videos.
Kwame
I mean, you do now why.
Vin Matano
I did have a few, now, but those are few and far between. Yeah. But, for the most part, it's been slow growth. And the first one I had was this, it was a $9,000 deal. And I remember, like, holy shit, like, holy shit. Like, this is crazy. Like, if this is something you can get monthly, like, you can, I mean, I can.
Vin Matano
Now I see the path of being a full time creator. And now I'm at the point where, because of the focus on the business, I basically only want to do things like these really high or premium brand deals. And if it's less volume, that's fine for me because I'm not relying on that, content income, for example. Like, you know, went to Cannes with Adobe and, so you can imagine a larger tech company probably pays better than maybe a smaller company in general.
Vin Matano
So that's the type of thing that I want to prioritize. Now, given that I don't need to do so much volume of brand deals.
Kwame
I can take that. So that's definitely a cool little compare and contrast of like, and, you know, it's interesting. I didn't really know what the breakdown of your, you know, finances were. So yeah, as an entrepreneur who also creates content, you don't have to tell us the digits themself. But in terms of percentage wise, how do you look at your income stream?
Vin Matano
Oh, man. Well, so I share a lot of the finances on LinkedIn. I do like this whole build in public content. And each month I break down the finances for the business. And part of that is showing brand deals that I get. I actually missed last month, but I will do one for June. I would say the brand deals probably equate to maybe like 25% of the revenue for the business.
Vin Matano
I just kind of have that funneled into the business. But now I'm at a point where I feel like, I think one of my hot takes. I think there's a lot of talk right now about, oh, we're prioritizing long term partnerships. And, you know, we want to work with creators, want to work with brands in the long term.
Vin Matano
And of course, that's the goal. But I think creators maybe are too hyper focused on that. And they shoot themselves in the foot because they want the long term partnership right off the bat. And in most cases, the long term partnership is never going to happen right off the bat. You have to basically prove yourself. They might give you one video, they might give you two videos, and from there they'll see, okay, this is a creator who we can trust and they'll keep coming back.
Vin Matano
And so, you know, with Adobe, for example, I worked with them a few years ago, I did a few videos for them, and I went above and beyond like, I, I was like, I need this video to be amazing. Like, I am not a creator who is like, if I get a brand new, I can do a lazy one just to get it out.
Vin Matano
I was like, no, I'm going to, yeah, I'm going to overdeliver. And ever since then it's been maybe three years. I've been working with Adobe, who is one of the main companies I want to work with, on a consistent basis. Now, they didn't say and they didn't come to me and say, hey, here's a 12 month contract.
Vin Matano
But they're pretty consistent when they come back with opportunities for events or specific product launches. And now they're like one of my brand partnerships and one of my, like, longest brand partnerships because I was willing to start off with just one video with them.
Kwame
That is. All right. That's dope. So.
Vin Matano
Yeah, last year I'll say this last year I made like $94,000 as a part time content creator. So again, the main focus was the business. I had a 9 to 5 job for the first half of the year. And then I ran the business the back half of the year. And through that entire year of 2024, I made $94,000 as a part time content creator.
Vin Matano
This year, I think we've already beat that, just because of the brand partnerships that I am forging. And, a lot of them are reoccurring now, which is, again, the point I made earlier of like, you know, getting in just with one piece of content, like just, just do it and overdeliver. That's for one video.
Vin Matano
Like give them two videos, like who cares? Like if they ask for one story, give them like 12 stories like this flood the feed and overdeliver and I'm sure I promise it'll pay off.
Kwame
I love it, I love the words of encouragement, the steps. It is, you know, I think it's really enlightening and eye opening to speak to someone who's very well versed in the industry. I feel like there's content creators and people who understand content creation. You know, I think that, you know, obviously if there's an overlap and you have someone who creates content that also understands the industry.
Kwame
Yeah, I think those things are important. But sometimes I feel like people who create content like me, I've learned significantly more about the content creation industry in the last year. Year, year and a half. You know, I used to create a lot of content and it was more so just getting the job done.
Kwame
And now I really understand a lot more of the ins and outs of it. And I feel like it's helped me significantly as a content creator. And it speaks to how much I make. Right? Yeah. Like, you know, already this year, last year, as a content creator as a whole, the thing, I mean like 80 K that's amazing.
Kwame
Right? Right. And that's a massive blessing. And I think this year I've already, you know, raked in about 210. Right. Yeah. And we're halfway through the year. That's a massive blessing. That's amazing. Right. Yeah. And I think a lot of that comes from understanding the industry a lot. You know, so yeah, it's all a blessing.
Kwame
And it's one of those industries where you have the opportunity to really like to invest in yourself, both within the time and the content creation aspect of it, but also learning about the industry. And if you can really get both down, you can do numbers. I'm still really, really intrigued. And interested in the streaming side of things, right?
Kwame
I really want to get into streaming because what I've realized is for streamers, typically their audience, like they are their product, they are their person. They are their niche. Right? I've noticed that a streamer could have 100,000 followers and get 10% engagement, right, which is an astonishingly high engagement ring.
Vin Matano
Oh yeah.
Kwame
Right. Like and that's because they are their niche. And so if they post a picture of them, people are like, this is why I follow this person, right? Right. As people who, you know, have different niches are like someone who's a social celebrity, who was on a reality TV show who, you know, which is very heavily focused on relationships, my niche ends up typically fitting into the, yes, me, but more so my relationship.
Kwame
Right. And so that's been an interesting one to really work around. Right. And I am currently trying to figure out a way to make my brand in my niche a bit more independent. Not to say I'm trying to separate from my partnership, but I am trying to make sure that on my page, the end product that people expect is me.
Vin Matano
Yeah. That's you know, and.
Kwame
So yeah you know I so it's a lot of work to get there. I think it's something that once people have it down they get a lot more impact out of the content they share. And they get the most out of their partnerships because there's a lot more trust within it. And I feel like streaming is a category of creator that is really good.
Vin Matano
Grasp on that. Yeah. So you bring up a good point. I want to I want to get your opinion on like niches, like what is your opinion on creators getting started with with the niches. Do you go pick a niche or do you kind of or no or no Tony or tenacious? What do you think?
Kwame
Yeah, it's really interesting. I think in order to grow, you have to have a niche, right? Like you have to have some sort of niche that people like to come to, to take something from. Right. It's very rare that people are able to just be just themselves and gain a following like, I know you could, but it's very rare and you have to do something really large in order to really see growth, especially in today's day and age.
Kwame
If you started doing this five years ago, it would have been a whole different story. But just about everybody can be a creator now, right? And so let's change a lot of things. And so with that being said, I think the best way to really gain a following through social media is to have a niche.
Kwame
And then if you want, as you gain, maybe as you set certain goals, let's say once I hit 100,000, I start to focus more on myself, right? I know fitness creators who literally say like, I like, I'll see a post from something and I'll be like, hey, I know I never really shared about my family or my relationship, but here it is, right?
Kwame
Right. They bring a bit of themselves into it, and then they slowly change that niche to more about them and their life. I would say the best niche that like if I had my way, like if I would, if I could jump into a niche, it would be lifestyle, right? Because ultimately you are able to talk about all the things that you experience and have them be a learning moment for your audience.
Kwame
Yeah. When you look at statistics, statistics say the two largest categories of content creation are lifestyle and fashion, right. And so a lot of people are within those categories. The category with the highest engagement rate, interestingly enough, is home decor. Yeah. Home decor for a couple of reasons. I think one, I think I kind of make up, but I think it makes sense.
Kwame
I think it's due to my level of expertise because anyone can be a fashion creator. But in order to have home decor you really have to know your stuff. Like you're putting, you know, putting one and two together. But the one that statistically is actually a viable truth to it is it's due to the, the, the number of followers, a vast majority of home decor creators fall into the micro and nano categories.
Kwame
And so once you are in the micro in that, you know, like categories of following levels, you get the most engagement. Obviously, as you grow, there's just saturation, there's more content, and then your engagement fades a little bit more. But those are a few things that I think about. So if I really, really want to hone in, I feel like I would pivot a little bit to lifestyle creating.
Kwame
But yeah, if you want to start from the bottom and grow, you do. You should probably pick a niche. Unless you're just really cool and always hang out with celebrities or something and people will just follow you because you're just an awesome person, you know?
Vin Matano
Yeah. Well, I think like what you said earlier about, now being in the industry, your content has improved. You understand it better. I think being in the industry as well, when we look for creators like the niche is very important because that's how we source creators. You know, if a brand wants to target a certain persona, we need that niche at least to tell us, okay, this is worth the investment.
Vin Matano
Plus, if you do have a niche, like, for example, in our business and, Creator Buzz, we're working with B2B creators. And so if we're looking for a specific persona like, we're doing a, we're doing a client campaign right now where they're looking to target CPAs. Only thing it's.
Kwame
Ah interesting.
Vin Matano
I didn't think there were even CPA creators. But there's like, yeah, a huge community of them. And so their product is for CPAs, and it wouldn't make sense to work with anyone else if they're not a CPA. So something like that, where the niche is so important, where like, we won't even consider anybody else if they're not in that niche.
Vin Matano
So I always recommend, you know, especially getting started, pick a niche, go deep with it. And as you grow, I agree with you, you can start to sprinkle in other areas of your interests and honestly if necessary, also spinning off another page like, there's a friend of mine, Jack Applebee. He grew as a marketer at first, but he loves basketball, and he started creating a whole other basketball page, and that page blew up.
Vin Matano
It's about him trying to like, you know, get back into basketball shape like in his 30s or whatever the case may be. And so now he has these two media properties. There's like one where he talks about marketing and he has like one of the biggest newsletters, I think, in the world for marketing. And then there is this whole basketball page where he's documenting his journey playing basketball.
Vin Matano
And so like, that's a case where it's like, maybe it makes sense. It's just a spin off from another page.
Kwame
Yeah. Now that's true. I mean, I know people who definitely like to keep certain pages within certain categories, and that makes a lot of sense because you want to be able to dive fully in it. Right? Like for me, I wish I had a yaping page. Right. Just because there's yeah, you know, there's points in my day where I just sit there and I'm like, yo, I want to talk about this.
Kwame
Yeah, yeah. You know, and so it's definitely a category that I feel like I'll start at some point. But that's, you know, now relating back to why I feel like at some point streaming is really going to be more of my category. And so I like it. I really want to learn a lot more about it. Like I see the Showspeeds and I see the cars and that and I'm like, they're very successful.
Kwame
And they're definitely like consistent streamers who are always on. I just want to be on for maybe an hour or two a day and have good, structured, intelligent conversations where you laugh occasionally, you know? Yeah. Yeah. You know, but I do think, like, I think they're really great ways for how to have people really support you as a human being.
Kwame
But, you know, I think, yeah, we're having a lot of good conversations here, man, and I appreciate you hopping on once again. We're coming up to the end of our conversation, so I'd love to just dive into a few things that we usually talk about with our creators. You know, I think there are a few questions that I feel like I already know the answer to.
Kwame
But I'll pivot a little bit because usually we talk a little bit about, you know, like, would you rather do Instagram or TikTok? And I know that you are someone who's very active on LinkedIn. Right? So that's your thing. So I think we could look at these from a frame of mind if you are a B2B content creator.
Kwame
You are very focused on LinkedIn, but otherwise within the content you create. What would you use? Is that okay?
Vin Matano
That's okay. Yeah. It's cool. I'm active everywhere, but I'm definitely my most active on LinkedIn. I'll say, okay. You know, in terms of like a strategy, I think like YouTube probably makes the most sense just because I think it's very similar to LinkedIn in the fact where you can go deep and share knowledge, and also you don't need a big following on YouTube, like one subscriber is worth so much more than like a TikTok follower or an Instagram follower.
Vin Matano
The followers on Instagram and TikTok are very people who get follower, a follower very generously. Whereas a sub on YouTube especially, I'm looking at my patterns, my habits. I'm like, I'm not sub into this person. I need to see multiple videos that I have on this person in order for me to subscribe, and even the videos I come back to, I often forget to subscribe.
Vin Matano
So I'm not that active on YouTube. But if I had to think from a business standpoint, I think YouTube probably would be number two in terms of what I personally enjoy using as a consumer Instagram, I just I just enjoy using Instagram because you have the reels feature, so you have that sort of, short form video.
Vin Matano
I love stories, like I love engaging people's stories. I love posting stories even. It has nothing to do with my business. I just enjoy it. And the DMs feature I feel like is way better than TikToks. I like engaging with people. I always do DMs I try to support as much as possible. And so yeah, that's what I would say.
Kwame
Okay, I can take that. That's definitely a good break down. So I appreciate that. So I guess like a couple other things, I'm just going to ask if it's a this or that, you give the answer and then you give a quick reason why. Okay, okay. So reels or carousels of photos.
Vin Matano
Reels because I just, I love making videos and I love telling stories through video.
Kwame
Okay. Nice. Would you rather do a brand partnership for, Well, I guess you're kind of into this. But would you do a short term or a long term in terms of brand partnerships?
Vin Matano
I think the long term is always the goal. But again, I don't think I would go away for a short term. You could have a really cool experience with a short term brand. And sometimes some brands don't need long term partnerships. Sometimes you run out of things to say with this brand. So I don't always think that long term partnerships are always the answer.
Vin Matano
And if it's a mutual fit and there's a really great integration, then yes. Yeah, definitely have that long term partnership. But don't forget.
Kwame
Yeah I can dig it I like that. So batch content or spontaneous creating.
Vin Matano
I'm like somewhere in the middle of that. So I don't do spontaneous creating where I just take my phone out like Sarah Louis and like, film herself. I can't do that. Need a.
Kwame
Script?
Vin Matano
Yeah, but, she's.
Kwame
Really good at that. Oh, she's.
Vin Matano
Great at that. And unfortunately, I don't batch my content, so I'm somewhere in the middle where, like, I'll write a script for one video, I record one video at a time, and I edit one video at a time. And then once that's posted, I move on to the next.
Kwame
Nice. I can do. All right. And so I guess in terms of this or that, we'll call it for that. But a question that I have for you to kind of end this round is, what do you think is the biggest time waster for new content creators?
Vin Matano
Oh good question. The biggest time waster for new creators is probably over editing their videos. And I'm speaking from experience like that was my biggest issue and it still is my biggest issue. I'm so maniacal. Like when I'm editing, I'm not even that great of an editor, but like, I, I'm like just looking through the detail and probably spending way too much time on something that probably doesn't have a good pay off, like the the, the the change in scene between one second and two second.
Vin Matano
Like it probably doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. Yeah. And especially if you're first getting started, like, I think I'm someone that thinks about quality over quantity. But I think when you're getting started, I think there's some merit to just putting out as much as possible just to kind of get used to posting. Yeah, I would say.
Vin Matano
Yeah. Don't get so maniacal about editing in the beginning.
Kwame
Yeah, I like that. It's interesting. You know, like Instagram now has a feature where it's like trial reels. And I saw a really interesting technique where you could create the same reel three times, right, with a different initial hook. Right. And then post it three times in three different places or sorry, at that, at three different times using those three different hooks and figure out which one is getting the most traction as a trial.
Kwame
Before you post it on your actual page and then just delete the other two, that's again.
Vin Matano
So there's a.
Kwame
Lot. Yeah, there's a lot of stuff now that helps you to open up and understand more the habits of your audience and kind of leverage the post more as opposed to being super, you know, curated about it and just see what happens. I like, you know, so I've yeah, I feel like a lot of stuff is leaning that way.
Vin Matano
Have you tried the trials? Yeah, I actually haven't tried it.
Kwame
I have not, I have not because I feel like most of my stuff is more specific to my audience. Right. Like they have to know me to really get it, but I do have a folder of, like, reels and TikToks that I'm going to create over the next month or so. I'm going to go on a bit of a spree soon.
Vin Matano
Let's go.
Kwame
Yes. So I'm going to create a lot of content over the next month. Especially because July 4th is coming up, we'll have some time off. So while I'm away, I'm going to do a lot of stuff. But during that time, I really, really want to start understanding a bit more about what I can create to relate to people and like how I can grow my audience.
Kwame
When I started this year, my goal was to get to a million followers, which is really, really tough, right? It's really, really tough to grow your following. So I'm now about to look at all the different ways that I see other creators grow, and I'm about to focus on those who really see if I can grow my audience.
Kwame
And so, yeah, I think the next one to be really telling, and, and during that time, I do think I may do a trial or two, but I think I'm going to just put out a bunch of content. You know, at some point I think it might be like one a day just to see what happens.
Vin Matano
Dude, sometimes you have to get in those areas where you're just experimenting with stuff, and I encourage that too. Like, I, I agree, I sometimes feel creators because I feel this way myself. I'm like, I don't want to flood my feed, but yeah, you know, I think you're right. I think it's okay to like, just try some stuff out.
Vin Matano
And sometimes it's like, okay, out of those ten videos, one popped off. What did you do that worked for that one video?
Kwame
Exactly. And I think one thing that content creators also have to keep in mind is like, your feed isn't as annoying as you think.
Vin Matano
Yeah.
Kwame
Right. People always think, oh, if I post ten things today, all of my followers are going to see all ten things that are false. You know, I would say it gets segmented to about 10% of your followers per your post. Right? And so if you post ten things, there's a chance that your most loyal follower would see maybe 3 or 4, maybe five of those.
Kwame
Right? But apart from that, most of the audience in terms of viewership is dispersed along all of your followers. So don't ever feel like you know you're doing too much or you have too much, because at the end of the day, there's so much content that's going out nowadays that it's like, so be it, like put it out.
Kwame
Well, if you post something an hour after you post something now, like, people probably would have digested this post and then moved on by then. Right? Right. Within that hour, they would have forgotten that you already took up your quota of posts for the day.
Vin Matano
You know? Yeah, yeah.
Kwame
It's not that deep. It's actually that that is the biggest. You know what? We need to cut just this part. Right. So that we put it on the internet for every content creator out there who was worried about people getting annoyed by their content if they post too much, I just want to let you know. It's not that it's not.
Vin Matano
It's really not. And also you're not as important as you think. So people are not keeping up with you. You could post, no one's keeping tabs on you.
Kwame
Yes, 100%. That's great advice. Like that is the truth to it. Right. And you know that that taps into a lot of other things we'll talk about. But ultimately, yeah, take yourself out of it. Take the cringe out of it. Take the ego out of it. Don't worry about your head. You know, like people thinking so, so and so about you.
Kwame
Don't worry about people worrying about you. Like go out there and do what you have to do. Like it's your life, it's your money, it's your quality of life that you are impacting significantly if you are diligent within your content creation. So go out there and do it in five years. That moment you'll think about it all the time.
Kwame
Be like, yeah, I did what I wanted to look where I am now.
Vin Matano
Exactly. Yeah, the best things in life, I think, are on the other side of cringe.
Kwame
Yeah, exactly. That is factual, man. So look then what we're going to, we're going to wrap this conversation up soon, but you know, as we go to wrap it up, obviously you're a big B2B creator. You're really, really, you know, thriving within space. And you are also like, you have a role in a job in a company that is focused on the success of B2B creation.
Kwame
Tell us what you think the future of content creation is and why you think B2B is such a good space to be in.
Vin Matano
Oh wow. And I could talk about this for a while, but I'll try to do my best. To summarize, I think, if you look, if you look at B2B, it's ten years behind what's happening in the consumer space. So all the trends you're seeing in the consumer space will start to happen in B2B. And yeah, one of my personal goals is that there's no top creator established on LinkedIn.
Vin Matano
You have. Yeah. Like I don't know, TikTok. Maybe it's Alex. Oh I don't know who the top creator is. YouTube is Mr.. Videos like LinkedIn don't have that person yet and so know the creator is going to be battling for that. But I think in terms of predictions what you're going to see is a lot of creator led businesses happening in B2B in tech, because you see it happen in the consumer space.
Vin Matano
There's like Logan Paul is prime, is Emma Chamberlain for coffee? Company. You have Hailey Bieber just sold her company for billions of dollars. I think one of the big trends we'll see is that, like if there is a prominent B2B creator, having them kind of be the face of a business while you have operators operating the business and building the business behind the scenes will probably start to come true.
Vin Matano
And I think that will be one of the biggest trends that we'll see in the next five years.
Kwame
Lies. I like it, man. There's definitely some people that stick out, but it's cool, right? I think you have a point is that nobody's so well established that that is the end all be all person. Yep. You know, so that's a really cool way to look at it, man. Yeah.
Vin Matano
LinkedIn's gone billion users and only 1% of their users create content.
Kwame
Wow. Impactful, right? They're crazy. I'm going to clip that moment insanely. So all right so look then any last words for our audience? You know, you've obviously crushed this entire conversation. So I appreciate you being here, but, you know, anything else that you want the people to know before we call it a day?
Vin Matano
Now, just thanks for having me, man. I think there's, If you are a creator, don't think it's too late. There's always an audience to build. If you put your own taste and your own basic opinion, on a certain topic, even if it's oversaturated. So just just go out and create.
Kwame
Yeah, I love it. Just go out and create. We're going to make a shirt. Let's make a collaborative, you know, collaborative shirt that's just go.
Vin Matano
Create, go creative, man. That's all it is.
Kwame
Exactly. So look, man, and thanks so much for giving us your time. It's been an absolute pleasure. I think that our audience is going to really, really thrive off of this conversation. And obviously, along with having our business structure of learning and things, it was also just good to get a little powwow and catch up since, since Cannes as well.
Kwame
So thanks again for your time, man. We really appreciate you.
Vin Matano
And likewise, I appreciate all you're doing as well. Your energy is contagious and great. So I appreciate that.
Kwame
Very sure, my man. So with that being said, thank you so much everyone for tuning in today. It's today's episode of Beyond Influence. We are excited to share it with you. And, until next time, we'll see you later.